ME Labs getting Lazy?

[krohtech]

I feel that MELabs is doing a great job. I have called for support on the trial version and received it without hesitation. I also had my disk munched just after receiving it in the mail and they replaced it for a minor shipping charge. I think the new power of 2.50 is great and I think they are advancing the product at a reasonable rate. Upgrades are sold at a very reasonable price. Have you ever upgraded a MS product for around 10% the cost of the original software? I am a beginner and have received a ton of help from MELabs, the manual, searching this forum and when all else failed posting for help. I think people need to appreciate how good we have it. I would love it if version 2.60 had integrated DMXIN and DMXOUT routines but like Melanie said that would be way too specialized so I will either learn how to do it myself or pay someone to do it for me.

[skimask]

Hello
You can use Atmel controllers with programming language Bascom, that is very identical to PBP pro but more, more powerfull.
Regards
Pedro

I have to disagree a bit (I said a bit, I didn't entirely!). Atmel/8051 based MCU's have been around longer than PICs, they have a larger following, but as far as more powerful? The power is behind the keyboard...not in the chip.

I would love it if version 2.60 had integrated DMXIN and DMXOUT routines but like Melanie said that would be way too specialized so I will either learn how to do it myself or pay someone to do it for me.

As far as the 'extended' command set goes, if you have written yourself a nice set of PBP extensions (see the Forum topic of the same name), you can easily INCLUDE them for easy access just as a normal PBP command, well, almost as easily. For instance, the PRINTSTR functions that I use for the graphic LCDs, I include 'nokiaknockoff.bas' into my main program. The 'nokiaknockoff.bas' file has the PBP code along with assembly extensions and I access those commands with a simple:
@ printstr 5,6,"this is my function"
inline with my normal PBP code...simple as that.
If you are able to get decent DMXIN/DMXOUT subroutines running, you can easily do the same, whether it be thru a GOSUB or a MACRO.
Of course it's not quite a good as the real thing, but it's a great stepping stone to learning the inner-workings of PBP and compilers in general.

[Pedro Pinto]

SKIMASK says:
I have to disagree a bit (I said a bit, I didn't entirely!). Atmel/8051 based MCU's have been around longer than PICs, they have a larger following, but as far as more powerful? The power is behind the keyboard...not in the chip.

I have in my previews posting that Bascom are more powerfull and not the chip

Regards
Pedro

[skimask]

I have in my previews posting that Bascom are more powerfull and not the chip
Regards
Pedro

See and read Post #3...
The power of ANY compiler/assembler/anything is in the keyboard/lever/anything operator...not the chip/engine/whatever.
Bascom may have more functions built into it when it comes from the factory, but is it really 'more powerful'?
It just means that somebody took the time to code more functionality into it (i.e. operated the keyboard better).
Again...Post #3...

You can have 2 out of 3...Fast, Cheap, Good
Fast and Cheap, won't be Good...
Cheap and Good, won't be Fast...
Fast and Good, won't be Cheap...

[Ryan7777]

If you don't innovate your product and you stand behind the whole "here it is, if it isnt good enough, go p*ss up a rope" mentallity, you will get smoked in the end by someone that is willing to innovate. period. the microsofts of the world never innovated, they only bought what someone else had already done and marketed it under the MS brand and now are in the position to charge an outragous price because they now have enough money to sue or buy out their enemies. it isn't because they offer a better product, far from it, they just don't give you a choice. but with micro's you DO have a choice, and I say if MElabs doesn't offer what you like, by all means find something better. and its great that some of us have found a market that they can use PBP in their business, and thats what they do all day, program in PBP, so they understand it top to bottom (and they probably don't know it all either), but some of us have other things to do, this is simply a hobby, and all we ask for is some help now and then from someone who's been there, done that.
Mr. Gates would have never in a million years been able to code windows, he was just smart enough to convice people to do it for him.
PBP like the above poster said was only meant to offer an alternative to basic stamps, which is typically more of a hobby item, so it would stand to reason more people are using PBP as a hobby.. So a message board that offers people help on projects is a great idea, but acting like someone is stupid because they ask for help is kinda lame (the first project in the PBP manual is how to flash a single LED, afterall).. And someone who only programs in assembly could say programming in basic is for people that need their hand held, and just about everyone who loves C do say that! So again, i'd go talk to MElabs, and if they don't see it your way, go fish in another sea!

[skimask]

Well, I agree with you on many levels! (hows that for ya? )
I think it all boils right back to the title of the thread, modified just a bit...
MeLabs gettings lazy?
Maybe it's not MeLabs that's getting lazy...maybe it's the end user...
End User's getting lazy?
Somebody always wanting something for nothing...
If PBP actually had all of those neato built-in functions, and had updates to add all of those new commands and the like everytime Microchip came out with a new PIC with new modules inside, PBP would cost as much as Visual Studio 2008 Enterprise (or whatever that really expensive version is), or the end user would end up paying big $$$ for updates because the updates are just that special.
But with all that in mind, there are a LOT of nifty add-ons right here in the forums that could be added to the core of PBP (i.e. the printstr function I keep talking about, DMXIN/DMXOUT type functions, the BarGraphs, and the list goes on and on...). PBP probably isn't a big enough money maker to be the core of a 2 man team at MeLabs and be the major focus. Who can blame them? Business is business...can't beat on something that ain't gonna make you no money...

[boroko]

Well, I just can't stay out of this... I should know better, but alas...

Even though I make products that I market using PBP, I am still a hobbiest for the most part. I have used PICs as glue for many years, but never really learned them as I should have. When I got started, it was pretty much assembly or nothing. I still remember trying to keep Parallax syntax separate in my mind from microchip. I clung to everything that I could find and struggled to make any sense of it.
What eventually happened was that I just gave up for many years. Dabble for a while and then just get frustrated and let it rest again.

I have seen meLabs come a long way over the years and I have been in another re-birth of learning. Most of the credit goes to Jeff and Charles (and LZ) for making an environment that has allowed me to do incredible things that I never could have accomplished without them.

I realize that things are getting more canned these days, and that is a blessing to us all, but for those that are disappointed in the offerings are free to write your own. You might be a bit suprised to find just how hard it is to keep up with every nuance of a flood of new chips and still keep the thing workable and still keep the doors open.

Their efforts continue to make it possible for me. The unbelievable usefulness of this list and the folks that are patient enough to keep answering mundane questions over and over again amaze me.
Thank You all.
-rant mode off-

Bo