Getting started... again...

[Neosec]

I see that the mikroElektronika boards have an on-board USB programmer, does PBP work with that programmer or would I still need a Pickit 2? As for the pickit 2 I see two available, a starter kit and Debug Express debugger which of those should I be looking at? I looked at the 18F4550 PIC and it is overkill for the project I want to do, I'm looking at the 16F series for now. Concerning the Leap form Basic Stamp to PIC I don't see much difference so I figure I'm missing something. If I use PBP and a PIC what's so different from the Stamp? The biggest differences I see are: no on-board voltage regulator, no direct RS232 com. Doesn't a programmer and debugger do what the RS232 did on the stamp?
Thanks for the Input!

Edit: Oh BTW, I'm more interested in making everything work properly and easily than in saving a few bucks. I figure I'll spend $500 - $1000 by the time I'm done getting parts and equipment and custom PCBs and membrane switches.

[Bruce]

I see that the mikroElektronika boards have an on-board USB programmer, does PBP work with that programmer or would I still need a Pickit 2?

PBP generates standard Intel .HEX files that work with pretty much any decent PIC programmer out there.

As for the pickit 2 I see two available, a starter kit and Debug Express debugger which of those should I be looking at?

The Debug Express version comes with a 44-pin surface mount 16F887 on a demo board that allows in-circuit debug. The starter kit comes with a DIP socket allowing 8/14/20-pin mid-range PICs to be used on the demo board.

If you're just getting started, the starter kit is probably your best option. Note: You will still want to grab a good PIC programmer like an MeLabs U2 for programming in-circuit, and the 840Z ZIF adapter which lets you program PICs from 8 to 40-pin packages.

I've had to re-flash my PICkit2 twice since I started using it. It uses a USB boot-loader, and is relatively easy to corrupt, so you'll want a device programmer to re-flash the PICkit2. Just in case. Once you corrupt the boot-loader on a PICkit2, it's worthless until you can re-program it.

Concerning the Leap form Basic Stamp to PIC I don't see much difference so I figure I'm missing something. If I use PBP and a PIC what's so different from the Stamp? The biggest differences I see are: no on-board voltage regulator, no direct RS232 com.

The BIG differences are speed of code execution, tons of built-in hardware peripherals like A/D, hardware PWM, comparators, hardware USART, timers, counters, etc. PICs have these built-in, a Stamp doesn't.

The Stamp compiler creates tokens, then downloads your tokenized code to an external EEPROM. This really slows things down. PBP creates a .HEX file, which is programmed directly into the PIC. This speeds things up. A PIC running at only 4MHz can execute 4 million single-cycle instructions per second. There's a BIG difference.

PicBasic Pro syntax is similar to the BS2. PBC is similar to the older BS1 syntax. I recommend you get PBP from the start.

Doesn't a programmer and debugger do what the RS232 did on the stamp?

Most PIC programmers do nothing but program your code into the PIC. The PICkit2 offers a few extra bells & whistles for serial communications, in-circuit debug, etc, but you'll still want to have a good device programmer handy that can do in-circuit programming and has a ZIF (zero insertion force) socket.

The MeLabs U2 USB programmer is excellent. They normally have support for new PICs ready & tested before you can even get engineering samples from Microchip.

[mister_e]

I've had to re-flash my PICkit2 twice since I started using it.

I had that problem too in the begining... never happen since awhile. Maybe because it's no longer plugged into a USB hub... who knows...

Out of curiosity, do you have the Red or Black Button version? In case you have the Black Button, here's a well documented step by step PICKIT 2 update.

http://www.seniordesignlab.com/sd_do...%20Updates.pdf

[Bruce]

Hi Steve,

Mine has the red button. It's directly connected to a USB port. Not a hub. I've had to reload the boot-loader twice.

It is a nifty gadget, and it's 'really' nice having the source code.

[mister_e]

I know they worked a lot on that recently. I haven't compare the original Bootloader with the actual to see if they already changed it.

Fortunately we have 3rd party programmer huh? JDM wouldn't work anyways

[Neosec]

OK, so If I got this right I should get...
PicBasic Pro
A U2 Programmer w/ ZIF adapter
Pickit2 Starter kit
mikroElektronika EZPic5 board

Seems like a lot of programmers but I suppose they each have their purpose.

[Bruce]

If you can afford all that, it would for sure be one nice package to have, but the minimum would be just PBP and a U2 programmer.

I have an EasyPIC3 board I'll give you if you order it from us. I've used it once. It's nice, but I just have no need for it. I use in-circuit programming, and prefer to build the circuit I'm working with VS using a dev board.