Proton PICBASIC vs MeLabs PICBASIC

[Fredrick]

Proton PICBASIC vs MeLabs PICBASIC what´s the diffrent`s?

Great forum btw.

[skimask]

Proton PICBASIC vs MeLabs PICBASIC what´s the diffrent`s?

Great forum btw.

Person 1 - PicBasicPro is the BEST!

Person 2 - No...Proton Rocks!

Person 1 - No...PicBasicPro is best!

and so on and so on...

Person 3 - Person's 1 and 2 are both wrong!!!

Get the datasheets/instruction manuals for both of them. Read them. Figure out what you want to accomplish. You might end up going with free assembly, or maybe even C, or something else entirely.
Personally, I've only used PicBasicPro. I like it and like it a lot.
I'm sure there's nothing wrong with Proton Basic, and if I'd have bought Proton instead of PicBasicPro, the argument would be the other way around in reverse upside down.

[Fredrick]

Ok thanx.
It´s like PC or MAC then...

So both Proton and MeLabs PICBASIC can do the same job! ?

[mister_e]

yup, both WILL do the same job, the power is back to the keyboard, not in your hard drive...

There's a lot of thread about that here, do a little search within the forum.

[Darrel Taylor]

I too have never used Proton before.

And all I can say is that there was a group of people here that used to be pretty good with PBP, who suddenly switched to Proton.
You'll now find those same people over at the Swordfish forum.

I would not recommend Swordfish for beginning programmers.

But if you're proficient in a language like Delphi (pascal), Javascript, or other "Highly Structured" languages, you might find Swordfish easier to work with.

_

[mister_e]

Down side... for 18F only

[Darrel Taylor]

Oh yeah, forgot about that.

Been back to PBP long enough not to remember.
Yes, I thought I had switched to Swordfish at one point.

But really, I've never come across anything I couldn't do with PBP.
Well, with a little ASM added

_

[mister_e]

and...
{.mod ...}
'
'
{.endmod}



As i said, the power is back to the keyboard.

I agree, PROTON may have better function set built-in. Where's the fun?

[tenaja]

I own both, and for the most part, I agree with the above comments. There are some significant differences worth noting.

PicBasic Pro (PBP) was designed to be a PIC alternative to Basic Stamp 2's. It's very good at that, and its code runs much faster than stamps. It is very easy for beginners to transition to PIC's from Stamps. I've made some good code with it. You pay for version updates.

Proton+ Development Suite (PDS) was designed to be a good PIC compiler, with many commands being Stamp compatible. (They've also added some similar commands that are optimized for your specific use, instead of a "catch-all" command.) PDS has a broader command range, and compiles code much smaller and runs faster than PBP. (My PBP code converted to PDS was about 20% smaller!) The current Beta version, which is available to all licensed users, has many new powerful features, like automatic variable saving for interrupts. (This makes a few of Daryl's add-in code obsolete.) There are three levels of optimization for even more compact code, that can save up to another 15%. For 18F's, both high level and low level interrupts are supported. Plus, you get a development board simulator to test your code in. PDS has a macro capability to make your own commands, and call them with parameters, just like any other basic command. I'm one of those who "switched", and most of what I do is now PDS.

Both forums have excellent support.

And yes, Swordfish looks neat, but it's only 18F's. I'm sure that will change, eventually, but probably towards more advanced PIC's. It's "structured", but that really only has a benefit if you are writing huge code (which 16F's and smaller can't handle). In reality, you can write structured code in PBP or PDS, too; it just looks slightly different.

[tenaja]

For those who don't know, Swordfish was written by the same guy who wrote MicroCode Studio (PBP IDE) and also the IDE for Proton.

[dhouston]

mikroBasic for PIC is another procedural basic. It's very advanced in some areas (e.g. handling interrupts), less so in others. It has a ton of libraries although they tend to be 18F oriented. It's worth investigating if you're trying to decide on a PIC development language. It costs less than PBP and you don't need a license for apps that are smaller than 2K.

[bcd]

I have a copy of MikroBasic, but find it frustrating that it does not have equivalents to SerIn2 command with time-outs if there is no data. So for any serial you need to write an interrupt routine otherwise the serial receive is a blocking command...

But on the other hand it does support GLCD, Ethernet parts and CF or SD Cards out of the box.

bill

[Luciano]

I have a copy of MikroBasic, but find it frustrating that it does
not have equivalents to SerIn2 command with time-outs if there is no data. So for
any serial you need to write an interrupt routine otherwise the serial receive is
a blocking command...

Hi Bill,

I have never used the MikroBasic compiler but after a quick
look at the PDF manual I have a solution for your software UART
timeout problem.

Best regards,

Luciano


From page 257 of MikroBasic for Pic.
(This is the original sample code).

' Here's a loop which holds until data is received:

error = 1

do
  data = Soft_Uart_Read(error)
loop until error = 0

Here is a version with timeout using BREAK to exit the Do loop:

' Here's a loop which holds until data is received
' or the timeout value has reached 10000. 

Dim MyTimeOutCounter as longint
Dim MyError as byte
Dim MyData as byte
....
....

MyError = 1
MyTimeOutCounter = 0

Do

  MyData = Soft_Uart_Read(MyError)
  
  MyTimeOutCounter = MyTimeOutCounter + 1 ' increment our timeout counter
  
  If MyTimeOutCounter = 10000 Then ' you will have to adjust this value
     Break  'Exit the Do Loop
  End if

Loop until MyError = 0

If MyError = 0 Then ' Optional IF 
  ' Serial transfer was successful
Else
  ' Timeout occured
Endif

[dhouston]

I have a copy of MikroBasic, but find it frustrating that it does not have equivalents to SerIn2 command with time-outs if there is no data. So for any serial you need to write an interrupt routine otherwise the serial receive is a blocking command...

But writing an interrupt routine is a piece of cake and examples are easy to find - I think they are even included.

[tenaja]

I don't use Mikrobasic, but here is an easy way to do it without interrupts...just translate the code to proper syntax. (And set the symbols of cTxReg etc. to the appropriate values. Leading characters are: c=constant, b=byte.)

bDelayTime = 0
CheckForData:
if cTxReg = cDataWaiting then 'check hardware Tx register for incoming data.
serin = bSerialDataIn 'get data...
goto SerialDataReceived
else 'no data waiting...
pause 1 'wait 1ms...change to match your baud rate, since some speed may overwrite
bDelayTime = bDelayTime + 1
if bDelayTime = cMaxWaitTime then
goto NoSerialDataReceived
endif
goto CheckForData
endif

[tenaja]

For those wanting to do it with interrupts, do a quick search for "buffer" on the Proton forum. ( http://www.picbasic.org/forum/ ) Les, the PDS author, wrote a subroutine for 18F's to buffer all incoming serial data. It should be possible (given enough ingenuity) to convert it to PBP or Mikrobasic.

[Luciano]

I don't use Mikrobasic, but here is an easy way to do it without interrupts...just translate the code to proper syntax. (And set the symbols of cTxReg etc. to the appropriate values. Leading characters are: c=constant, b=byte.)

bDelayTime = 0
CheckForData:
if cTxReg = cDataWaiting then 'check hardware Tx register for incoming data.
serin = bSerialDataIn 'get data...
goto SerialDataReceived
else 'no data waiting...
pause 1 'wait 1ms...change to match your baud rate, since some speed may overwrite
bDelayTime = bDelayTime + 1
if bDelayTime = cMaxWaitTime then
goto NoSerialDataReceived
endif
goto CheckForData
endif

Hi,

Your code does not work with software UARTs.

Software UART routines use bit-banging techniques and can use almost any I/O pin
of the microcontroller. Software UARTs have big limitations and if the microcontroller has
hardware UARTs just use them!

Best regards,

Luciano

[tenaja]

Your code does not work with software UARTs.

This is absolutely true.

[dhouston]

For those wanting to do it with interrupts, download the Soft Uart for P12 by Warren Schroeder project from http://www.mikroe.com/en/projects/

It's an excellent tutorial as well as an interrupt driven full-duplex software UART. The code is quite simple and easy to follow.

[tenaja]

One nice thing about Proton+ is in the forum, Les the compiler author occasionally posts misc. PDS code. (In addition to helping out on the forum when needed.) For instance, he's posted a full Space Invaders game that works with the Crownhill development board... which is modeled in the VSM simulator so you can play it right on your PC screen (or the actual development board).

He's also posted code to use as a serial buffer for the hardware usart, so it will receive data in the background, and fill it in when you get around to using a hserin command. More examples are speech decompression routines, and a full .wav file player design with CF FAT and audio out routines.

These are just a few examples. Some of them can easily be ported to PBP; others may take some work.

[Luciano]

For those wanting to do it with interrupts, download the Soft Uart for P12 by Warren Schroeder project from http://www.mikroe.com/en/projects/

It's an excellent tutorial as well as an interrupt driven full-duplex software UART. The code is quite simple and easy to follow.

Hi,

Full-duplex software UART is not possible or possible only if the baud rate
is very low and interrupts are used. (Software UARTs use bit-banging).

Soft Uart for P12 by Warren Schroeder:

If you look at the code you will see that RX uses an interrupt and that in
the SUB TX_19200 interrupts are disabled. This means that while
you are sending data you cannot receive data at the same time. (Not Full-duplex).

Best regards,

Luciano

[tenaja]

Full-duplex software UART is not possible or possible only if the baud rate is very low and interrupts are used. (Software UARTs use bit-banging).

It could be done if you send and receive in the interrupt. Set it to interrupt at 2*baud, and alternate Tx/Rx. At 9600 baud, with 19200kHz interrupt rate on a 20MHz crystal, you get 260 code cycles to perform each...that should be more than enough, and cycles left over for other regular code. You might even get close to that rate with a 4MHz crystal if you are thrifty with your code.

Or, in the interrupt do the Tx send first, then all Rx work, then Tx setup for the next bit, without alternating, so the "Tx send" portion is actually very short and always the same length. This might be more efficient, but maybe a little more coding.

[bcd]

Luciano -

I will try that code. The last time I tried the Soft_Uart_Read was blocking. I see v6.0.0.0 has a heap of changes.

I just found it frustrating when trying to convert a simple working PBP program to MikroE Basic. What better way to learn a new language than to convert code you already know and understand in PBP.

I'll stick with PBP for now until I need ethernet or have some time to do some test projects.....

bill.