PBP projects for R/C models

[ScaleRobotics]

What else do I need? I am confused but very impressed by the young man in the video. I'll get the ZIGflea later.

Yes, me too!

That should be all you need. However, this one does not come with StickOS installed. But you can use your PicKit2 to install StickOS firmware into it. And, by doing that, you will get the latest 1.80 version. You will need to download a windows driver from this page CPUStick.inf : http://www.cpustick.com/downloads.htm

But with that, and hyper terminal, you can start writing some code. Oh, and you won't get a manual either, so you will have to print one.

Walter

[Ioannis]

Hi Ken. I do not see why you should leave PBP and start another similar language and your project all over again.

If you do need RF communication between nodes maybe a Zigbee modules or RF transceivers can give you a good solution without almost a line of code.

Look at Digi modules (Zigbee or not, does not matter) for out of he box communication. Other brands also exist, many I can say.

Ioannis

[ScaleRobotics]

I do not see why you should leave PBP and start another similar language and your project all over again.

I wouldn't normally suggest it, as PBP can do just about anything. But here is why I think it might be a good idea in this case.

Configs are confusing for adults, I would hate to frustrate middle school students. This would keep them from having to worry about those.

PBP kind of expects you to read and understand the data sheet. StickOS would just require them to get read the device pinout. They could just start with the data sheets for their sensors, and not be overwhelmed by a 200 to 500 page data sheet.

They would not have to worry about setting ADCONx, trisx, cmconx etc...

With StickOS, they can just say:

10 dim pot as pin an5 for analog input 
20 print "potentiometer= ",pot

Now here is some PBP code that does a similar function:

Define ADC_BITS     10  ' Set number of bits in result
Define ADC_CLOCK     3  ' Set clock source (3=rc)
Define ADC_SAMPLEUS 50  ' Set sampling time in uS

adval Var Word          ' Create adval to store result

   TRISA = %11111111    ' Set PORTA to all input
   ADCON1 = %10000010   ' Set PORTA analog and right justify result

mainloop:
   ADCIN 0, adval       ' Read channel 0 to adval
   serout2 PORTC.6,396,["Value: ",DEC adval,13,10] ' Display value
   Pause 100            ' Wait .1 second
   Goto mainloop        ' Do it forever

End

And pretty high up there in my opinion is the cost. I know the school my son goes to has trouble buying pencils and paper. They would pretty much need everything donated to be able to do it. I think Ken said the cars were $80, this CpuStick is about $40. The PBP software is $250. So the cost per unit is $120 with StickOS vs $370 for PBP. That's over three times the cost. So, for the same cost of having 30 students share 10 PBP units (one kid does the work, while the other two watch), they could have one for each kid in the class.

[Kenjones1935]

There is already an educational oriented company, www.Ten80Education.com, which uses model level 1/10 scale radio control cars. They focus on automobile related engineering, toe-in, tire friction, gearing, power usage, damping, suspension. The car they use, the HPI Sprint, costs about $200 retail. Coincidentally I chose this same car for my project. I hope to integrate my PIC car into their curriculum.

It is the add on cost for my project that must be controlled. The sonars cost $28 each. It is really too bad that the PBP cost is just for a one PC license.

Big question?? What kind of games could our robocars play if they could talk to each other over zigFLEA?

Ken

[Kenjones1935]

I use the model level car because its steering and wheel drive is based on proportional PWM signaling. This I need for the wall following (at speed) trick.

The much cheaper ~ $50 ~ 1/10 scale toy level car has bang-bang steering that motor control. If that is all we need for the learning game, then the total cost comes way down. These cars are FAST.

Ken

[Ioannis]

These cars are FAST.

Yeah, but with very little control on the steering. Like you described it as bang bang (to the walls)...

The fuse settings, or settings in general may be solved by an include file made by Ken and students all have to do is just ... include it.

So they are left with the main body of the software. Which comparing to stickOS is a little more difficult. But you have interrupts and much faster execution time...

About the cost, well, OK. 250 is much money, but good things cost...

Ioannis

[cncmachineguy]

I have been folowing this thread. I have a question about the steering: I get it's bang bang, but what actuates it? is it a spring returned solinoid or a motor? I am thinking there should be a way to pulse the steering to simulate proportinate control. Does it really go full left or right with just 1 frame of command?

Also, as Dave suggested, can you create it so the demo version could be used? Maybe write some subroutines to "include" so all the power of PBP isn't required.

Then if some of the students are really intrested and want to go further, they can be pointed to PBP for their parents to purchase? As a parent, I would gladly buy a copy for my kid(s) if they were to show me they actually wanted to play with it. It would be far better than an x-box orother such stuff.

[ScaleRobotics]

Yes, ignore the warning. That is a default if Windows doesn't know what the file is.

[ScaleRobotics]

Now you can start to write some simple programs. They show some examples in the manual. You will need to look through the Quick Reference guide here: http://www.cpustick.com/downloads/quickref.v1.80.pdf for all the commands.

Some of the interesting ones are:
help
help pins

And you can set the heartbeat LED (if it is not blinking already) by:
pins heartbeat RA1
(You will have to look on the board to see which port goes to the LED you want to set as heartbeat, RA1 is PORTA.1 and works on my Explorer 16 board).

This prints out an analog result to the terminal:

10 dim pot as pin an5 for analog input 
20 print "potentiometer= ",pot

You would probably be interested in the Servo example on page 30:

> new
> servo
45
> 10 dim servo as pin dtin1 for servo output
> 20 for servo = 50 to 250 step 10
> 30 sleep 50 ms
> 40 next
> run

Note that you will have to change the servo out pin to one your hardware has. To see the available ones, use the "help pins" command. It will show you at the bottom which pins are available for the servo command. In my case, I changed dtin1 to rd1.

[Kenjones1935]

scalerobotics,

My focus is changing from teaching STEM to middle school kids to teaching the teachers about teaching STEM to public school kids.

Documenting our conversations over the last months might give me some insight on the process. Is there a way to capture this thread as a .doc or a .pdf file?

Ken

[ScaleRobotics]

Documenting our conversations over the last months might give me some insight on the process. Is there a way to capture this thread as a .doc or a .pdf file?

Once a routine is made, a lot of it can be forgotten (thankfully). I don't see any good ways to do this, but here is one way. It will only get you 40 posts at a time though. I have looked for a way to change this setting, and it looks like it is not settable, at least by me.

If you goto thread tools, and click on show printable version, you get something of a better format. Then you can go to file, and save as, and save it as html. While you are on this printable version, you can then select the next page of posts, and select save as, then call it page2 or something. This isn't ideal, but it's the best I can come up with.

[Kenjones1935]

The cost of the PICWhacker ~$40 is too much. Its appeal is that all the PICspins are available through 0.1" centered holes. Is there any PC product of which you know that has this PDIP configuration with only the PIC and a USB connector aboard? You guys had a forum "off topic" that sounded like you all built some yourselves. Did this work? I know that I could not solder those tiny leads on the PICWhacker board.

Ken

[rtestardi]

Hi,

However, this one does not come with StickOS installed. But you can use your PicKit2 to install StickOS firmware into it. And, by doing that, you will get the latest 1.80 version. You will need to download a windows driver from this page CPUStick.inf : http://www.cpustick.com/downloads.htm

But with that, and hyper terminal, you can start writing some code. Oh, and you won't get a manual either, so you will have to print one.

Walter

I just stumbled onto this thread...

I'd like to also point out you don't actually need a PicKit2 to program the UBW32, since it comes with the Microchip HID bootloader installed -- you can just download StickOS to the board using the procedure here: http://www.schmalzhaus.com/UBW32/doc...mentation.html

Be sure to use the proper version of StickOS for the UBW32: http://www.cpustick.com/downloads/St...v1.80c.elf.hex

I'm definitely game to help folks get this into a classroom setting -- let me know if I can help. (Just drop me an e-mail; unfortunately I'll be out of town for a week starting tomorrow morning.)

One small comment on an earlier post -- if you are using pins rd0-rd4 on the PIC32 and configuring them for PWM/servo mode, then they are controlled in hardware without CPU assistance -- so the BASIC program can do any other things while they are generating pulses, without affecting the pulses.

-- Rich
[email protected]

[Kenjones1935]

For reasons to messy to explain I am trying to get a robocar to run on a blank 32MX460F512L. I was hoping to use Microchip's C compiler pic32-gcc.exe. I am having a very difficult time getting started. Do you know of a beginners example that will take me though step by step?

[ScaleRobotics]

Oops, I guess it is not free anymore. Or at least, only free for 10 days. Looks like it is 9.95 for one month, or 59.95 for a year. They have added a few features since I last looked. Here is a shot from their logic probe demo:



And I guess there are 9 chips it supports from Microchip:

[Kenjones1935]

Folks from MIT's Lincoln Laboratory have taken an interest in my robocars for kids. LL has an Education Outreach program which schedules workshops each summer. If you like go to
http://roboworksmay22.eventbrite.com/

Note the sentence:

Follow-on workshops are planned for the summer where kids will learn to program general purpose processors to control sensors for an autonomous robotic NASCAR.

Let me THANK YOU ALL for all for two year's of support. LL seems Arduino oriented. I don't know why, but they have the resources and the prestige to take this to the next step.

I'll keep you informed if I can.

Ken

[mackrackit]

Hi Ken,

Sounds like things are finally rolling for you.

You may want to look at this section

http://www.picbasic.co.uk/forum/cont...r=346-amicus18

It is a hardware replacement for the ardrino that uses PICs and PBP.

[Kenjones1935]

Hi everyone, I have not disappeared..

I have a PBP question/problem. I need to create a pulse width modulated pulse every 20 milliseconds. I also need to have the PIC be doing all its work between these 20 msec events.

INTERRUPTS should do it, but I have not been able to decode the manual on how to use them. How do I (can you point me to an example?) set an interrupt for when a 20msec timer (driven by the 4mhz oscillator) overflows? During most of the 20 msec the PIC has to do its sensor triggering and decision making business. Every 20 seconds it must send out two carefully crafted pulses to the Electronic Speed Control and to the steering servo.

Help.....

[ScaleRobotics]

VBB is tri-lingual. It can do Arduino, Amicus, and 7 flavors of Microchip. I have not looked at it for a few months, but for free, it looked pretty cool. But, the closest thing to an 887 that it has is an 877.
Walter