4550

Printable View

- 10th February 2007, 00:00
jukeman

Pic18f2455/2550/4455/4550

Hello,

I'm new so go easy!

My question is on the PIC18F2455/2550/4455/4550 series of pics if the usb is handled as usb or if it is usb in and treated as serial for the firmware on the micoprocessor. What i want to do that's easy for me is write my code in Visual Basic for the computer and use serial code then use a usb serial port driver to send the info over the usb cable.

I already have a setup with a controller board now but the processor is serial with usb circuit to serial.

Thanks for any help and suggestions!
Kevin
- 10th February 2007, 01:43
skimask

Quote:

Originally Posted by jukeman

Hello,

I'm new so go easy!

My question is on the PIC18F2455/2550/4455/4550 series of pics if the usb is handled as usb or if it is usb in and treated as serial for the firmware on the micoprocessor. What i want to do that's easy for me is write my code in Visual Basic for the computer and use serial code then use a usb serial port driver to send the info over the usb cable.

I already have a setup with a controller board now but the processor is serial with usb circuit to serial.

Thanks for any help and suggestions!
Kevin

Did you do any searching at all on this site for anything relating to USB?
Did you even try to find the slightest example of the simplest application using USB, a PIC, and Visual Basic?
Did you even think about trying to do any work yourself?
Anything at all?
The link below took me approximately .0000000000000000000001 seconds to find on this site using an appropriate search phrase.

http://www.picbasic.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=5418

Amazing isn't it?
- 10th February 2007, 17:38
jukeman

All i can say is WOW!

I can't see the message because i went blind about a year ago, i have an associate that helps me with my electronics projects. He looked over the material but being new to microprocessors and the forums he could not get a answer to my question. It wasn't evident to do the search.

Sorry if i have upset anyone!
JM
- 12th February 2007, 05:35
vacpress

a civil answer

Skimask - for shame, really.. that post you directed the chap to isnt even appropriate - please reserve your bad attitude, why are you here if you cannot tolerate questions?

i dont know all the correct terminology, but, in answer, the PIC18F2455/2550/4455/4550 chips handle usb 'natively'. they have built in hardware USB ram and other features to support usb. They are different from an FTDI type RS232 to USB chip. However, the PIC chips can be made to emulate the functionality of the FTDI chips using firmware from microchip.com.

checkout the datasheets.. the first few pages are easiest to understand for a beginner, and list the features.. as you learn more, it will begin to make more sense.

the microchip website (www.microchip.com) has preixisting firmware to make a 4550 or similar USB PIC into a serial device.

If you want an easy path to experiment with USB on a pic, perhaps the microchip pic usb demo board would be usefull. It is only $60, which isnt bad for a demo board, and it looks like 'fun', almost.

the link that you were directed to was also very usefull for me to get started with usb and visual basic. this uses the HID driver which is included in most operating systems. this saves you having to write a dedicated USB driver, which is apparently very difficult. Please search google for HID. Or, just goto wikipedia..

If you have any specific questions feel free to ask, i am not very well versed, but I did spend alot of time figuring out how to get basic usb stuff going, and would be happy to try and help.

goto google, search '18f4550 USB picbasic pro'

let your text to speach software lull you into a stupor while you try to digest all the info for usb.. i had to read quite alot of the usb spec to understand what the software was doing..

also, check www.mecanique.co.uk - the provide a program that makes it much easier to implement usb..

do some reading, and come back - people here are quite helpfull if you give them a specific question.. they really hate naive requests for 'general info' - they dont always consider how dense the subjects are for a beginner!

Robert
- 13th February 2007, 01:06
jukeman

Thanks for the response!

By the way i am not blind and just said that so he would feel bad for being so rude. It's nice to see there is still some half way decent people out there. And if your offer still stands i may ask for help sometime!

I noticed he knew about the post because he was running the post with questions like a little beginner!

Where can i find the pic18f4550 demo or protoboard i have looked on microchips site and melabs and can't find it anywhere?

Sorry for the feel bad post!
Kevin
- 13th February 2007, 18:12
bbarney

here you go junkman
http://www.microchip.com/stellent/id...wwPICmicroDemo

Skimask
You gotta get out of the cabin more :) your starting to get the fever :)
- 13th February 2007, 23:35
skimask

Quote:

Originally Posted by bbarney

here you go junkman
http://www.microchip.com/stellent/id...wwPICmicroDemo

Skimask
You gotta get out of the cabin more :) your starting to get the fever :)

Heck, I'm in Tucson, Az. for 7 weeks... ok, I'm taking classes for mini-micro-Class 3 circuit card repair...but at least I'm not in ND during that crazy cold snap (the wife is, but I'm not).

And as far as the link goes...did that link I provided not point directly to a USB demo board directly from MeLabs? Anyone?
- 14th February 2007, 01:39
vacpress

please stop acting silly. if people cannot be civil on web boards about a shared interest, where can i go for intelligent discussion of technical things? this seems to be more and more common on these boards.. digression can be charming, but only if it is charming digression...

http://www.microchip.com/stellent/id...&part=DM163010

there. it was in the 'conectivity demo boards' section...

really. have you got a working carrier circuit? have you got a programmer? have you got a cut USB wire or a USB protoboard jack? How close are you to actually working with usb?

USB the first time reminds me of parallel port the first time like 5 years ago.. it seemed so difficult. just read some.. get interested in the technical details you 'dont even have to know to do the job' if you ever expect to be good at anything!

skimask has seemed helpfull in other threads.. it must just have been a bad day.. please stop fighting!
- 14th February 2007, 01:48
skimask

Quote:

Originally Posted by vacpress

please stop acting silly. if people cannot be civil on web boards about a shared interest, where can i go for intelligent discussion of technical things? this seems to be more and more common on these boards.. digression can be charming, but only if it is charming digression...

http://www.microchip.com/stellent/id...&part=DM163010

there. it was in the 'conectivity demo boards' section...

really. have you got a working carrier circuit? have you got a programmer? have you got a cut USB wire or a USB protoboard jack? How close are you to actually working with usb?

USB the first time reminds me of parallel port the first time like 5 years ago.. it seemed so difficult. just read some.. get interested in the technical details you 'dont even have to know to do the job' if you ever expect to be good at anything!

skimask has seemed helpfull in other threads.. it must just have been a bad day.. please stop fighting!

Well, that board will work too, but it's mainly for the older PIC 16C types. The MeLabs board will run an 18F4550. And, if a person wants to basically ignore the USB protocols altogether and just pretend it's a serial port, that person might look at the CP2103 (www.sparkfun.com), or maybe the FTDI232 type chips (www.ftdichips.com).
They're basically USB <-> serial converters and they work great.

Bad Day - Nope, Good day. Haven't had a bad day in years. I just seem to keep stating the blatently obvious...to someone that's looking anyways...and missing it...
- 14th February 2007, 01:49
vacpress

http://www.microchipdirect.com/Produ...%20Kits&mid=13

that is the link to buy the thing, should you actually be serious about this and need a real helping hand in the form of prebuilt hardware...

the previous link was the a more expensive version of the thing. i dont know the differences. i built my circuits on breadboard.. total cost: about $8.00 or less - cuz the chips are samples..

you know the sayings.. the types that apply.. first you crawl... then you...

first you get good.. then you get fast.
- 14th February 2007, 01:50
jukeman

What did i do to you that you think you can give me this much crap. First off for anybody posting read my post, it was asking Vacpress about the board not either one of you. Yes i saw that board, i'm not retarded. It's not the one that Vacpress was talking about(read the posts).

You know I think you just want someone to fight with, well go beat the hell out of your wife for a while and leave me alone!

I just figure it out, Your dad was a drunk and used to beat the hell out of you, someone sexually molested you or kids at school used to pick on you. So you think you can take it out on everyone else because they can't see you or get to you! Would you like to talk about what happened(who cares).

Dude you got some real issues!

Here is what i see going on with any of you on this forum that wants to act like a--h---s is you must feel threatened that someone is going to learn something fast and something you don't know.

I will be contacting the forum admin and letting him know the pure rudeness on this forum!

Shimass, I'm done with you, so if you don't have anything good to say then don't post.

By the way Bbarney it's Jukeman not Junkman!

You want to see my projects then you can check them out here:
www.freewebs.com/artdecojukebox

I will just find another forum i don't have time for this trying to make me feel stupid chit chat!
Thanks Vacpress! seems like your the only level headed one here!
Kevin
- 14th February 2007, 02:33
jukeman

Ah I See What The Problem Is Now After Seeing Your Site Is We Are Alot Alike In Some Respects, That's Why We Can't Get Along! :)

Same Interests, Hobbies Etc. I Just Don't Have All Of My Projects Posted Yet!

SO YOU IN THE MILITARY EH! I THOUGHT YOU WOULD BE A LITTLE MORE RESPECTFUL!
- 14th February 2007, 02:40
bbarney

hey don't rag on me.I was trying to help by posting the link to something you asked for and misspelled your name which was a typo,I wasn't trying to be smart.
- 14th February 2007, 02:46
jukeman

Wasn't ragging just correcting, easy dude!
- 14th February 2007, 06:17
Bruce

Sorry to interrupt. That's an awesome jukebox. Nice work.
- 14th February 2007, 11:50
jukeman

Thanks Bruce, It aounds really great too. Better than i ever imaginesd. Keep checking back on the site i will be adding more pics on the build, lighting and software! Sign the guest book if you like!
Kevin
- 14th February 2007, 18:31
keithdoxey

Quote:

Originally Posted by jukeman

You want to see my projects then you can check them out here:
www.freewebs.com/artdecojukebox

Kevin

Hi Kevin,

Nice to see another Jukebox fan on here :)

Your Jukebox looks really good. If I were to win big on the lottery, unlike most people, I wouldnt rush out and buy a Ferrari or Porche... I would be buying several classic jukeboxes. AMI Continental, Seeburg KD200, Wurlitzer 1015 etc.

I did actually own a Jukebox at one time, a late 60's Jupiter 80. I went into a local shop to buy a sweatshirt and the owner had the jukebox for sale for only £20 ($30) so I bought it. I then later made the foolish decision to swap it for some furniture :(

I designed my own web based Jukebox about 7 years ago and can access it from any of my PC's. The current plan is for the server to be built into one of those miniature Radio/CD player Wurlitzers. Bought one off eBay, ripped the guts out and havent got the new insides fitted yet. It will have PIC controlled LEDs behing the bubble tubes :)

I have also designed an AV rack that looks like a Wurlitzer 1015 but havent had time to build it yet. Look forward to seeing your project evolve.

Regards
- 14th February 2007, 18:42
Bruce

Here's another one created by a Proton user I thought was pretty slick;
http://www.soundsensedigital.com/

I have a 'thing' about really nice looking wood, so I still prefer Kevins
(awesome woodwork by the way), but this one's pretty cool too.
- 14th February 2007, 19:47
keithdoxey

As a modern digital jukebox it is very nice but I still prefer the classic 40s/50s/60s looking jukeboxes :)

There arent that many places with Jukeboxes now. At one time almost every British pub had a jukebox and I used to be able to guarantee that I would own >95% of the songs on them. Now all the pubs have projectors or plasma screens and show SKY Sport on them all the time :(

I also prefer Pinball machines to Video Games :)
- 15th February 2007, 02:02
jukeman

Thanks Guys!

Actually my influences were sparton radios http://www.all-unique.com/Sparton-History.html jukeboxes from the very beginning and old radios from the same time period which i used to collect. I just wanted it to be computer controlled with a complete sound system.

Once the lighting is done i think it will look awesome. Did you guys see the light grids and software that some friends and i wrote?

Sorry about the earlier posts, i just let somebody get under my skin and i should have known better because i'm better than that!

Kevin
- 15th February 2007, 09:25
keithdoxey

Quote:

Originally Posted by jukeman

Thanks Guys!

Actually my influences were sparton radios http://www.all-unique.com/Sparton-History.html jukeboxes from the very beginning and old radios from the same time period which i used to collect. I just wanted it to be computer controlled with a complete sound system.

Once the lighting is done i think it will look awesome. Did you guys see the light grids and software that some friends and i wrote?

I love Art Deco as well, particular old Cimemas and other Art Deco buildings.

Saw the lighting stuff, looks good. I also noticed that you were a DJ for 25 years... I was a DJ from 1973 to 1991 and during the 90s maintained most of the disco equipment in my town (about 20 venues).
- 15th February 2007, 11:51
jukeman

I've always been a electronics nut, I built some of my first dj equipment back in 1978 becuase there wasn't a real easy access for buying that type of equipment. I built my own mixer, speakers, amp and lighting. I have always been into lighting and later purchased some real cool stuff when I was making better money. I moved to another location still here in Ohio for work. When I moved i lost all of my customers. I used to work on equipment for a couple of bands and also did some sound work for a couple of local Chamber Of Commerce.

I built the juke because my wife would complain that she could never find my music or even know which case to look in. When i started it i was on a real tight budget and as the project continued i made some changes and got some better stuff. I have gad people ask why don't you put a flat screen in so it is also bigger. I told them i like the look and flat screen don't have as good of a picture than tube monitors. Besides it would mean cutting that all out and making a new bezel around the monitor. If you have seen old tv's and radios the screen or dial always looked small in comparison.

What I am looking to do with some pics is lighting control but i have alot to learn to get started. I plan on working with a couple of friends to design some new boards.

I great to know there is some people out there with similiar interests!

Gota Go For Now!
Kevin
- 15th February 2007, 18:05
mister_e

Nice job Jukeman.

I'm still a D.J. in nightclub here... and yes i remind those years ;) I think everybody tried to build their own equipment. At least Mixer and Light Chaser. Mine was made with an old Commodore Vic-20 :eek:

Good luck!
- 16th February 2007, 01:08
jukeman

Ah! Yes! The Vic20 and the Commodore64, that's what i learned programming on. Wow it's amazing how much we all have in common. I suppose you guys have been into remote control cars etc.

You guys need to keep checking my site, i am going to add a bunch of pictures.

Say what is a good book to learn the 4550 or pic projects?

Kevin
- 17th February 2007, 19:26
vacpress

back on topic

now that is is back on topic ( i have had 3 or 4 RC cars.. 'real ones'. commodore -> 286 -> 386 - 386 w hdd -> p1 -> p2 and so on..)

i just picked up jan axelson's 'USB Complete'. The choice was between that and another, more technical looking book.. really, what it comes down to is USB is not a parallel port - it is closer to a serial port, but worse...

Because USB was written to be extensible and provide an 'all inclusive' framework, it is quite complex... The USB Complete book is a good place to start, if you are too lazy to read the USB spec sheets(usb.org), or want something you can take on the commute to work, or something..

really though, the first step is too find a working code example, and get it working on your breadboard. The USBdemo provided by mister_E is a fabulous place to start. It is 'easy' compared to trying to do your own project immediately...

(start a new thread about jukeboxes)
Robert.
- 17th February 2007, 20:42
mister_e

Quote:

Originally Posted by jukeman

I suppose you guys have been into remote control cars etc.

Euh... only remote car starter, car alarm, car audio, car radio decoding & repair etc etc
- 17th February 2007, 22:48
jukeman

Quote:

Originally Posted by vacpress

(start a new thread about jukeboxes)
Robert.

Start a new thread as interest or seperate it from this post? I know that this is not really a jukebox forum so i was going to do that, but i can!

I got Jan's book on Serial and i think it made me more confused but maybe i'm just thick headed.
Kevin
- 18th February 2007, 04:27
vacpress

serial communication is really much 'simpler' than USB, but so far as i can tell also similar in many ways... with usb, like serial, you setup variables to store incoming and outgoing data. you have interrupts deal with data you are not quite ready for.. then you parse the data and do it all over... just like RS232..

USB gets confusing quickly because the framework requires certain 'environmental standards', such as endpoints, product ids, vendor ids, device class definitions, packet size settings..

again, sir, please, checkout a) the wikipedia entries on USB and HID b)www.mecanique.co.uk c)usb 1.1 spec at usb.org d)mister e's demo

if you cannot make progress in this manner, i would recommend you abandon 'USB', and look into FTDI type solutions... USB => serial chips\adapters\boards/

programming these devices in not for the faint of heart, nor does it take a genius.. but you do need able to comprehend a+b+c= abc. (this of course being a metaphor.. not pseudo-code)

and the new thread for jukeboxes.. it could be in the sandbox... as it would be 'off topic'. and now it is time to enter the fridgid chicago night to drink in public. ciao. ciao.

Robert