thanks

[jcleaver]

i want to thank those of you that have made a effort to help during my learning experience on pics

[skimask]

i want to thank those of you that have made a effort to help during my learning experience on pics

Well...if you're going to give the heading a thumbs down (in an effort to convey an air of sarcasm), then you can count on ZERO future effort from me. After all, I've got nothing better to do than to lead a person by the hand, repeatedly explain the obvious, regurgitate facts that are already published in multiple places, etc.

[jcleaver]

Well...if you're going to give the heading a thumbs down (in an effort to convey an air of sarcasm), then you can count on ZERO future effort from me. After all, I've got nothing better to do than to lead a person by the hand, repeatedly explain the obvious, regurgitate facts that are already published in multiple places, etc.

[skimask]

Well...if you're going to give the heading a thumbs down (in an effort to convey an air of sarcasm), then you can count on ZERO future effort from me. After all, I've got nothing better to do than to lead a person by the hand, repeatedly explain the obvious, regurgitate facts that are already published in multiple places, etc.

:D Sweet :D

[jcleaver]

the original message was not supposed to have a thumbs down
there has been many people that have helped along the way
however there has been those that give nothing but negetive comments
dont need that if someone does not like my posting ignor it that simple

perhaps I should explain better how I got to this point.I have worked in electronics ddc control systems all my life. when I retired I started playing with microcontroller to build projects. started with parallax. they have a great product excellent documentation and support. got me hooked. however the cost of chips is very high for someone that likes to build. so I went looking for something else. found pbp and was told it was just as good and after spending considerable on the program I would be able to do the same thing. however and if someone else reads this beware I WAS NOT TOLD I would have to learn a 300 pg manual for each chip. As well as terms that are totally unknown to me , did not want to do this therfore the posts asking for the correct usage for that chip.also i would like to say my programs work fine just can't seem to get the registors and all the other things down had someone warned me I would never have gone this route. I do thank those that have taken the time to help without the scarasim. there has got to be somthing in the middle for us hackers.

[Pic_User]

Hi jcleaver,

Do not get discouraged. The atmosphere on this forum has changed a little, to the mean spirited side of the spectrum.

Like a pendulum, it will return toward the center. As we learn that the forum is not, to flaunt our knowledge and snap towels at each other, things will improve.

My advice is to ask the questions, that beginners have to ask. Ignore the crap thrown at you. Pick the helpful wheat from the hurtful chaff. Until you reach the tipping point of knowledge. Then you, can give the helpful answers, to the new beginners and help the pendulum tilt to the other side. “Use YOUR powers for good not evil”.

You are correct to warn beginners about the very steep learning curve between BASIC-Stamp-s and PIC-s. There are a whole new level of concerns. Things that affect one PIC and not another, absolutely true. But, to compare a BASIC Stamp [model] to a wide selection of choices and then think that choice is a negative attribute is not fair.

Try selecting a single PIC that has the capability to do most of the things that you want the BS to do. Make sure it is a “main-stream” device (search for of posts already out there about it). Learn THAT PIC, frontward and backward. Build the things that you would have built with the expensive BS.
Have fun (ignore the crap answers, on the forum), learn. Then, when you have that one PIC mastered, you can go on to more powerful PIC-s by learning just the difference between the PIC you know and the PIC you are learning. At this point you will be soaring above anything a BASIC Stamp could dream about.

Don’t let ‘em wear you down. Keep posting questions. That’s how the forum is supposed to work. We were all beginners once.

-Adam-

[skimask]

I WAS NOT TOLD I would have to learn a 300 pg manual for each chip

Dude...
what are you talking about? Each and every PIC out there today (and yesterday, and probably future types also) is practically the same. Even the differences between PIC10xxxx, 12xxxx, 16xxxx, and 18xxxx is very minimal, at least as far as PBP goes. They've all got the same basic setup for ports, serial ports, A/D modules, timers, practically everything works the same way on every PIC out there ('cept for those USB types, haven't quite mastered the innards of those yet myself). If you write a program for one PIC, chances are it's going to work on another PIC in the same family (i.e. PIC16F628A vs. 16F88) with very little modification. If if you change PIC families (i.e. PIC16F628A to PIC18F1320), from a PBP standpoint, again, the program will have to be changed very little. Same thing goes for the learning curve...if you know one PIC, you know them all.
Just takes a bit of effort...and like the other guys said, you have to learn at least one PIC all the way thru.
And, I'm not 'mean-spirited' by any stretch, at least I don't think so...just tired of seeing other people wanting things handed to them like they are somehow 'owed' that piece of information.

[jcleaver]

don't seem to follow my input I am not referring to the programs they work fine and are easily transferable as well as the i/o and others.
what I am saying is all the other stuff required of the chips to operate
fuse ,trisa, osccom and all the other commands that is not part of the program but rather a requirement of making a specific chip function. and yes all the chips seem to have there own little twist to get operating. again I am not referring to what I consider to be the program that is straightforward and simple its the gingerbread thats tough for us non engineer type.

and in regards to spirit the old adage about comments hold true if its not positive its negative.

ignore posts you don't like they were probably sincere in there desire for help and really don't need a
post from there mothers

[etarhan]

Hi all,

Before my retirement, training technicians was among my duties for a looong long time (over 20 years). I was purposefully snappy against questions, telling them to RTFM, almost always in English language, even though the individual tech did not speak or understand the language. The purpose was to "encourage" them to refer to the manual which would be available long after I was not.

Now I am a completely "new" guy in the field of PIC, particularly in the details of the available development software, and from what I see in the responses of some helpers (guides? instructors? leaders?) that my previous attitude earned me a lot of hard feelings to put it very lightly, from those which I was supposed to be "helping".

I share the comments about today's youth being very lazy to page through a thick manual when it's extremely easy to ask someone to give them a "pill" suitable for their exact problem. I even myself feel tempted to do it that way sometimes, because it looks faster and easier. This is something that we have to accept, because we are not capable of changing it. Up to now, I could manage to raise only my daughter with an inquisitive mind and a researching attitude, that's all. I (unfortunately) understand that I have little chance of influencing others in this matter.

Nevertheless, "banging the idiots on the head" with snappy comments is not the proper way, I now understand looking at this "mirror". The most efficient way would be subtly and gently guiding them to the name of the document and the number of the page they should read, and hope that they will get used to it in time and accept it as the "regular" way of learning.

I am grateful to see that the number of people like my "old" self in this forum is really in the minority and most of the contributors are really trying to help as much as they can.

This message is not related with this thread, but it's perhaps related to all the questions which has drawn at least one snappy response.

Regards,

Engin Tarhan

[rhino]

The purpose was to "encourage" them to refer to the manual which would be available long after I was not.


Hit the nail on the head. I really think that's what is going on. Look at it from this prospective...
We have members who are well versed in using the Pic products and PBP. These guys have 1000+ posts.(note: I am not one of these gurus) But when the answer to a lot of the redundant questions are already answered on the forum.... many times, I think people get tired of trying to guide them through the datasheets and manual. Heck, let's face it, some people really don't even try to find the answers in the datasheet, manual, or searching the forum. I can understand how it can get aggrevating. I'm certainly guilty. I guess, every once in a while we need to sit back and think of a different approach. Hard to do... for sure.